Upgrade advice needed

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    • Upgrade advice needed

      Hi everyone,

      After almost two years of using OMV, my NAS is running out of space so it is time for an upgrade! I am not a complete n00b but an extra pair of eyes looking over my build and/or an expert opinion would be much appreciated. Currently I am running this build:



      Currently using ext4 as file system with SnapRAID as a safeguard but I want something more secure. After a day of searching and reading up on the latest developments considering Btrfs and ZFS, I've chosen to go the ZFS Raidz2 road. My plan is to fill up all the 6 disk trays with 3TB disks which leaves me with 12TB of space according to this and this calculator. My plan was to use 5 3TB disks and 1 TB disk to setup the initial ZFS storage tank, copy the data from my data disk to the tank, take the 1TB disk out, put the 3TB disk in and let the array resilver. Is this a possibility?

      Since the motherboard has 6 SATA ports and the OS disk takes one, I need to buy a hard disk controller card with at least one SATA controller. Can I buy an el cheapo one or do I need to buy something like a Highpoint Rocket 640L in order to achieve decent read/write speeds? Should I connect the storage HDD's directly to the motherboard and the OS disk to the SATA controller?

      Also, I am planning on buying at least one extra ram module of the same make and model. I've read that while using ZFS for each TB you need approximately 1GB of RAM. So one should be enough or do I need more?


      Thanks in advance for any tips/opinions/etc!

      The post was edited 1 time, last by iddqd ().

    • tinh_x7 wrote:

      Everything looks good, except the Red 3TB NAS.
      3TB is faulty, don't buy it.
      I'm currently using it, and I had replaced my drives three times already in one year.
      I have been running 2x Wd Red 3TB for almost two years without a single problem.

      For the zfs part, I have tested only for a short period. But my conclusion was indeed to make sure you have enough RAM.
      As far as I now, the raidz(2) is not expandable. So you would need to create the complete array at once. But maybe I am wrong?!
    • I wonder what exactly do you mean by "more secure"?

      I have been seeing people referencing ZFS more and more but still can not figure out what is the benefits it has that I can not get from other existing file systems.
      what security ZFS gives you over other FS?
      I am partial to BTRFS myself but it never hurts to learn new things.

      PS>> from my point of view, wouldn't a SnapRaid + BTRFS give you close to if not the same options as ZFS array but in more manageable and by far easier expandable setup?

      I mean, feature by feature BTRFS provides almost the same data protection as ZFS except
      BTRFS raid is expandable on the fly, it is also convertible on the fly from one raid option to other.
      except RAID 5/6 which are still not stable enough as far as I know, but raid1 and raid 10 are.

      or a snapRaid over BTRFS individual drivers also give you flexibility and peace of mind with much easier dependability and management.

      am I wrong here ?
      omv 3.0.56 erasmus | 64 bit | 4.7 backport kernel
      SM-SC846(24 bay)| H8DME-2 |2x AMD Opteron Hex Core 2431 @ 2.4Ghz |49GB RAM
      PSU: Silencer 760 Watt ATX Power Supply
      IPMI |3xSAT2-MV8 PCI-X |4 NIC : 2x Realteck + 1 Intel Pro Dual port PCI-e card
      OS on 2×120 SSD in RAID-1 |
      DATA: 3x3T| 4x2T | 2x1T
    • tinh_x7 wrote:

      Everything looks good, except the Red 3TB NAS.
      3TB is faulty, don't buy it.
      I'm currently using it, and I had replaced my drives three times already in one year.
      I don't use ZFS, can't help you.

      mbotje wrote:

      tinh_x7 wrote:

      Everything looks good, except the Red 3TB NAS.
      3TB is faulty, don't buy it.
      I'm currently using it, and I had replaced my drives three times already in one year.
      I have been running 2x Wd Red 3TB for almost two years without a single problem.
      For the zfs part, I have tested only for a short period. But my conclusion was indeed to make sure you have enough RAM.
      As far as I now, the raidz(2) is not expandable. So you would need to create the complete array at once. But maybe I am wrong?!
      First of all, thanks for your feedback!
      I have two 3 TB WD Red's running for over a year without any problems. I'll probably switch to HGST drives since these are the most reliable according to Backblaze. Kinda funny since HGST is owned by WD.
      @mbotje, you are right about raidz2 not being extendable, but for the foreseeable future 12 TB should be enough for my needs. I did take a look at BTRFS but RAID5/6 isn't considered stable and I really want a set and forget storage pool.


      vl1969 wrote:

      I wonder what exactly do you mean by "more secure"?

      I have been seeing people referencing ZFS more and more but still can not figure out what is the benefits it has that I can not get from other existing file systems.
      what security ZFS gives you over other FS?
      I am partial to BTRFS myself but it never hurts to learn new things.

      PS>> from my point of view, wouldn't a SnapRaid + BTRFS give you close to if not the same options as ZFS array but in more manageable and by far easier expandable setup?

      I mean, feature by feature BTRFS provides almost the same data protection as ZFS except
      BTRFS raid is expandable on the fly, it is also convertible on the fly from one raid option to other.
      except RAID 5/6 which are still not stable enough as far as I know, but raid1 and raid 10 are.

      or a snapRaid over BTRFS individual drivers also give you flexibility and peace of mind with much easier dependability and management.

      am I wrong here ?
      I can try to explain why ZFS and btrfs, in theory, are better compared to filesystems like EXT4, XFS, etc but this article sums it up quite nicely.
      Since I want to use either ZFS or btrfs and since I want to be able to loose 2 drives without loosing data I have 3 options (correct me if I am wrong):
      1. Use btrfs RAID6. Not advisable since, according to the btrfs wiki: "The parity RAID code has multiple serious data-loss bugs in it. It should not be used for anything other than testing purposes.". I could use RAID10 but then I would be left with 9TB of usable storage space.

      2. Btrfs or ZFS formatted disks with SnapRAID. More flexible but you have to run scripts in order to make it work, which to me feels a bit "hack-y". It will work though if you set everything up correctly.

      3. Use a raidz2 (ZFS) pool. Easiest to maintain, next-gen filesystem, simply set and forget, 12TB of usable storage space. Not expendable however.
    • thanks iddqd.

      just want to response to the last post a bit.



      iddqd wrote:

      I can try to explain why ZFS and btrfs, in theory, are better compared to filesystems like EXT4, XFS, etc
      I did not ask why ZFS/BTRFS are better, I did my research on both and so far I personally prefer BTRFS for most applications.
      You said you were looking for something more secure so I was curious what that mean. is ZFS more secure than BTRFS?!



      now option 2 is very doable with OMV since plugins make things a lot easier. I have played with BTRFS+SnapRaid setup for a while
      and it works. it even schedule scrubs and syncs for you easily. there is maybe scripts underneath all of that but I never seen any my self. not since version 3.0 update. in 2.0 you had to add script and set a cron job for it. V3.0 have all built in.

      as for how easy it is to maintain ZFS pools I can not say. I simply do not understand them enough to judge.

      I am looking into moving my setup to OMV on Proxmox and my main stumble block is not able to install Proxmox on raid-1 OS drive. have option for ZFS/Raid1 but no idea on how would I recover the setup or know if any of the drives failed.
      omv 3.0.56 erasmus | 64 bit | 4.7 backport kernel
      SM-SC846(24 bay)| H8DME-2 |2x AMD Opteron Hex Core 2431 @ 2.4Ghz |49GB RAM
      PSU: Silencer 760 Watt ATX Power Supply
      IPMI |3xSAT2-MV8 PCI-X |4 NIC : 2x Realteck + 1 Intel Pro Dual port PCI-e card
      OS on 2×120 SSD in RAID-1 |
      DATA: 3x3T| 4x2T | 2x1T
    • tinh_x7 wrote:

      Everything looks good, except the Red 3TB NAS.
      3TB is faulty, don't buy it.
      I'm currently using it, and I had replaced my drives three times already in one year.
      I don't use ZFS, can't help you.
      I have four WD Red 3TB NAS drives in my OMV for more than a year. No problems with any of them. The machine is on 24/7 and sees fairly heavy use.
      OMV 4.x - ASRock Rack C2550D4I - 16GB ECC - Silverstone DS380