Switching to OMV from Synology? General questions and request for advice

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    • Switching to OMV from Synology? General questions and request for advice

      Hi there,

      I hope it's the right spot here. I have currently my second Synology NAS running, a DS216+II. My volume is slowly running full, but I think I have several months, if not a year, left before I really have to take actions. Nevertheless, this triggered again considerations whether I just upgrade my drives or whether I set up my own server. I am tending to do the latter. But from this nearly made decission arise new questions and I hope I can get some guidance here.

      I will try to write down a short summary, why I came up with my current NAS, how I am using it currently, and what bothers me. This should lead to a list of questions I couldn't answer myself yet.

      Before my current NAS I had a DS413. After some crash of it my volume got damaged. With the help of Synology I could repair it, but there was doubt whether some files got corrupted. I wanted to use my Synology Backup but, this didn't worked, because the backup tool forced it to do a integrity test which failed then. So I had to do a new backup from the doubtfull volume. I am quite sure now that I didn't loose anything back then, but it was quite close. So I thought about data integrity and found btrfs and that other Synology models support it. This made me switch the NAS towards my current model. But I think that the lacking of ECC RAM is a bummer in this regard.
      How I am using my NAS: I think it's a quite common usecase.
      Data: I have several shared folders for me and my wife or my HTPC with different users and permissions. I solely use SMB to mount them. I have everything on my NAS. My PCs are solely workstations and hold no data. Thous I really care that they should be safe there. Currently it's not encrypted but I think I will change that again in the future.
      Data-Integrity: My idea was to use BTRFS in order to avoid bit rot and have errors automatically repaired. I do a backup on my USB-HDD on demand (again with the Synology tool :/ ), I have an older backup on an second HDD. A third layer of security is an automated encrypted backup of all folders once a day to GDrive in order to have something if the first backup dies or the house burns down, theft or whatsoever. To protect the hardware and volume from "blackouts" I have a small USV that if the battery is activated sends a signal to the NAS that triggers a safe shut down.
      Services: I don't use any of the Synology services. I only let run an AV from time to time and of course the administraton tools. I run an Emby Docker container that provides at the moment one Kodi client with metainformation. Currently I don't use the streaming from Emby since the NAS is not powerfull enough.

      There are some things that bother me with my setup. First and most importantly, I felt a bit betrayed when I later figured out that BTRFS without ECC is maybe not that secure and even gets risky when my RAM should get damaged. I want my data storage robust and "self healing" and get to know when some files might be corupted and I should check for earlier versions in my backups. Although I am a fan of not running to many disks I feel a bit limited right now because I can't extend my raid and have to replace my disks, which is with only one nas a long lasting thing because I need to use the backups. The power of the system is sometimes a bit slow. I dont use Emby for playback since even display of subtitles takes to much power. Lastly, something which is more expandeble. I have on my HTPC a TVHeadend server/client combo. For the future it could be nice to integrate the TV-Card into the homeserver and access from different clients and have recorded shows directly on the server.

      So that was one long text! Thanks for reading already!

      So obiously I would require OMV to fullfill all my current needs and the things I am lacking currently. But I am not hundred percent sure about all the points and whehter OMV can do this and what the best option might be. So it cums up to the following priotirized list, if I didn't forget anything:
      - I want a system that holds my data secure and guarantees data integrity. So using ECC RAM is a must. OMV does support BTRFS and ZFS over a plugin. I saw on github a proposal that in the future solely BTRFS should be supported. I am not a FS expert and really unsure what would suit me best and what the future of OMV might be.
      - I guess backups (encrypted and decrypted) are of course somhow integrated in OMV. So I have no doubts about my USB-Backups but what about my daily GDrive backups? This would be highly important for me.
      - Can OMV work together with my USV as the Diskstation does?
      - Not really a question but, user permissions, Docker, Samba I expect to work as usual

      That's really the end now. I know that are a lot of questions, but since I spent a really high effort and money on my data and my home IT, I really don't want to make similar mistakes like with the decision to the DS216+II again. I would really like to make an elaborated decission being aware of the features and drawbacks it comes with.

      Best,
      FordPrefect
    • @FordPrefect: Welcome to the forum!

      Oh freddled gruntbuggly,

      Thy micturations are to me, (with big yawning)

      As plurdled gabbleblotchits, in midsummer morning

      On a lurgid bee,

      That mordiously hath blurted out,

      Its earted jurtles, grumbling

      Into a rancid festering confectious organ squealer. [drowned out by moaning and screaming]

      Now the jurpling slayjid agrocrustles,

      Are slurping hagrilly up the axlegrurts,

      And living glupules frart and stipulate,

      Like jowling meated liverslime,

      Groop, I implore thee, my foonting turlingdromes,

      And hooptiously drangle me,

      With crinkly bindlewurdles,mashurbitries.

      Or else I shall rend thee in the gobberwarts with my blurglecruncheon,

      See if I don't!

      :D
      About your post: a bit of text to read.
      OMV 3.0.99 (Gray style)
      ASRock Rack C2550D4I C0-stepping - 16GB ECC - 6x WD RED 3TB (ZFS 2x3 Striped RaidZ1)- Fractal Design Node 304

      Post by cabrio_leo ().

      This post was deleted by the author themselves: dupe ().
    • Sorry, but I just flew over your text and read mainly your questions.

      FordPrefect wrote:

      I want a system that holds my data secure and guarantees data integrity. So using ECC RAM is a must.
      If you buy the right hardware with ECC support then you are on the right way.

      FordPrefect wrote:

      OMV does support BTRFS and ZFS over a plugin.
      The ZFS integration in OMV by the plugin has only limited functions. Be prepared to learn a lot about ZFS basics and how to use the command line. It´s the same like with other RAID solutions: You must know what to do.
      I Have never used BTRFS. Some say it is stable, some say it is not.

      FordPrefect wrote:

      Can OMV work together with my USV as the Diskstation does?
      UPS is supported by the NUT plugin. It´s up to you to buy an UPS which is supported by network ups tools.
      Personally I use an UPS and it communicates with OMV.

      FordPrefect wrote:

      Not really a question but, user permissions, Docker, Samba I expect to work as usual
      I would say yes, all of that is possible.

      FordPrefect wrote:

      So I have no doubts about my USB-Backups but what about my daily GDrive backups?
      Check the WEB-DAV plugin.
      OMV 3.0.99 (Gray style)
      ASRock Rack C2550D4I C0-stepping - 16GB ECC - 6x WD RED 3TB (ZFS 2x3 Striped RaidZ1)- Fractal Design Node 304
    • @cabrio_leo thanks for the reply.
      Regarding the ECC I am a bit torn. I would prefer Ryzen but the ECC support is a bit undefined. There are many boards which support ECC and the CPUs can handle it as well, but it's not officially suported. The corresponding server hardware has trippled costs.

      I am not afraid of the command line. I am not a linux pro but, I am running it since over a decade and got experience with Ubuntu, Fedora and lately Arch. I am also not afraid of reading. The only thing is it should not become a constant construction side with neverending pitfalls. Because that will be the opposite of stable. I don't mind if set up and installation takes time and effort, but once it's ready it should be easy maintainable. I am maybe also a bit spoiled from DSM, because the maintanance goes nearly to zero.

      I will search for the NUT plugin and see if it's supported. But I assume it will be.

      Regarding cloud backups. I searched for the mentioned plugin and found in addition openmediavault-duplicati. Is there a reason you mentioned WEB-DAV instead or were you just unaware of this plugin?
    • FordPrefect wrote:

      Regarding the ECC I am a bit torn. I would prefer Ryzen but the ECC support is a bit undefined. There are many boards which support ECC and the CPUs can handle it as well, but it's not officially suported. The corresponding server hardware has trippled costs.
      ZFS and BTRFS are both possible also without ECC RAM. ECC RAM is recommended but not compellingly necessary.
      Here there are two camps with completely different opinions, which argue about it excellently.

      FordPrefect wrote:

      I don't mind if set up and installation takes time and effort, but once it's ready it should be easy maintainable.
      I think I can aggree with that. OMV consists of a base system with additional functions added by plugins. Therefore there are a lot of possible combinations. There is always a risk for incompatibilities, especially when updates are done.
      What I understand is, that in OMV5 the concept has changed a little bit. Some plugins are replaced by docker containers, which reduces the risk of interference and the maintenance effort for the plugins.

      FordPrefect wrote:

      Regarding cloud backups. I searched for the mentioned plugin and found in addition openmediavault-duplicati. Is there a reason you mentioned WEB-DAV instead or were you just unaware of this plugin?
      Try both and take what fits best to your purpose. :)
      OMV 3.0.99 (Gray style)
      ASRock Rack C2550D4I C0-stepping - 16GB ECC - 6x WD RED 3TB (ZFS 2x3 Striped RaidZ1)- Fractal Design Node 304

      The post was edited 1 time, last by cabrio_leo: typo ().

    • cabrio_leo wrote:

      ZFS and BTRFS are both possible also without ECC RAM. ECC RAM is recommended but not compellingly necessary.Here there are two camps with completely different opinions, which argue about it excellently.
      I know that it's possible without ECC. My Diskstation is running BTRFS without ECC, which is one of my biggest problem with it. As far as I read running such FS without ECC can easily cause the system running amok if the ram gets bad. So setting up a system with ECC would be a must if I should switch to a homemade NAS.
    • But it's independent from incremental backups right? I guess a lot means over 32GB?

      Another question: I guess with OMV I have the same hardware support as with the underlying debian, right? Or is there any extra repository or modified Kernel? I am asking because using a server also as TVHeadend server I would need support for my DVB-T2 card.

      Regarding the NUT plugin, is there anywhere a list of supported devices? I have a APC Back-UPS BX - BX700U-GR.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by FordPrefect ().

    • Good morning!

      FordPrefect wrote:

      But it's independent from incremental backups right?
      Yes, Deduplication has nothing to do with backups.

      FordPrefect wrote:

      Another question: I guess with OMV I have the same hardware support as with the underlying debian, right? Or is there any extra repository or modified Kernel? I am asking because using a server also as TVHeadend server I would need support for my DVB-T2 card.
      I would say, yes. It is possible to install Debian first and then OMV on top. There are several threads about this in the forum.

      FordPrefect wrote:

      Regarding the NUT plugin, is there anywhere a list of supported devices?
      NUT = Network UPS Tools: Supported hardware compatibility list
      OMV 3.0.99 (Gray style)
      ASRock Rack C2550D4I C0-stepping - 16GB ECC - 6x WD RED 3TB (ZFS 2x3 Striped RaidZ1)- Fractal Design Node 304
    • I think the driver for my card is included in the kernel anyway. My UPS seems also to be supported. Duplicati sounds exactly like what I would need. Encrypted and incremental backups to cloud storage. I guess beside the data volume one can use it too backup the system too, right? Maybe I will install it on my Synology NAS and create backups already. I assume the backups are completely unrelated to the hardware, so I can create them with my Synlogy and continue to update them with a custom server. Or even recreate the data with it, but local will be faster anyways; no gigabit downstream in Germany :(.

      So I think OMV could provide me with the services I need and would support my existing hardware. The only open thing I have to figure out is, what FS and hardware to use.
      What I got is that from a data secutirity and integrity point of view both are similar. ZFS is more mature but not directly supported. I read that OMV will maybe support solely BTRFS from 6.x on, but I read that it has currently some pitfalls too.

      Regarding Hardware it's maybe not the right place to discuss.
    • FordPrefect wrote:

      I guess beside the data volume one can use it too backup the system too, right?
      Not sure if it is working. Backup of a life system is always a bit risky. I prefer clones with Clonezilla. On the HC2 additionally snapper as the root FS is btrfs.

      I think you have not asked about it, but anyway: a nice tool to backup clients with Linux or Windows to the NAS is UrBackup.
      There is a plugin in OMV4. In OMV5 it will be docker or native install from CLI.

      By the way: nice thread, everybody is from Germany and still English language :thumbup:
      Odroid HC2 - armbian - OMV4.x | Asrock Q1900DC-ITX - Intenso SSD 120GB - OMV4.x
      :!: Backup - Solutions to common problems - OMV setup videos - OMV4 Documentation - user guide :!:
    • macom wrote:

      FordPrefect wrote:

      I guess beside the data volume one can use it too backup the system too, right?

      Not sure if it is working. Backup of a life system is always a bit risky. I prefer clones with Clonezilla. On the HC2 additionally snapper as the root FS is btrfs.

      Hmm I see. I think Synology doesn't backup the complete OS but only the configuration of it, which is without a hazard than. It's maybe not to important to do this on a regular or daily base. If I have to do it manually and save the backup to the server from a different PC it's also fine. If I have to configurate all the time on it, it wouldn't be the right OS in the first place.

      macom wrote:


      I think you have not asked about it, but anyway: a nice tool to backup clients with Linux or Windows to the NAS is UrBackup.
      There is a plugin in OMV4. In OMV5 it will be docker or native install from CLI.

      Actually I don't have a need for this. The moment I started transfering all my files onto a NAS, my systems became all replaceable. Only my wife is still a bit behind but she will transfer her data at one point too. If I would screw up my Laptop beyond recognition I wouldn't bring back a backup but follow my nice customized arch install script and continue with a fresh system. But of course I could use this software for example to create a backup of the server from my PC.

      macom wrote:


      By the way: nice thread, everybody is from Germany and still English language :thumbup:

      Funny! I will do my very best to keep it running. I was already a bit surprised to see a lot of strings in the forum on german. Is OMV such a german thing?
    • FordPrefect wrote:

      Is OMV such a german thing?
      Volker alias votdev is from Germany and is the developer of OMV. ryecoaaron is from the US and takes care of the plugins.

      Would be interesting to see a usage statistic per country like this one for urbackup

      You will find many nationalities in the forum.
      Odroid HC2 - armbian - OMV4.x | Asrock Q1900DC-ITX - Intenso SSD 120GB - OMV4.x
      :!: Backup - Solutions to common problems - OMV setup videos - OMV4 Documentation - user guide :!:
    • Okay, a look at github made it obvius that indeed OMV looks like a one man project of votdev. Impressive but also a bit frightening. I recently started using rEFInd and directly the quote from the developer there comes to my mind: "If I get hit by a bus, most likely the project ends."

      So I guess the idea of switching to solely BTRFS for data volumes from 6.0 on and cutting update paths from 4.0 is, in this case, more than just a proposal as it comes from votdev himself.

      Edit: I'm referring to this: github.com/openmediavault/openmediavault/issues/101

      The post was edited 1 time, last by FordPrefect ().