OMV Has to be the best out there......

  • So I just wanted to share my opinion. I have tried most of the freely available DIY NAS server OSes out there, and I keep going back to OMV. I'll be honest, I'm more of a noob when it comes to Linux / Unix as I just recently reminded myself. Most of the alternatives require a good deal of knowledge about the command line just to get started. I'll give Rockstor an honorable mention. I guess I wrote this to say thank you to the developers at OMV for the ease of use, and reliability. It's good stuff.

  • I really liked Freenas (when Volker was there).. I could never warm up to BSD, but I could get the basic stuff done. When Volker left, iX took over, etc... it was such a mess I switched to using Ubuntu Server. It wasn't easy, but I got through it and used it pretty successfully for a bit when I heard Volker had started OMV and it was based on Debian (which I've always really liked). That was October 2011, and I tested it for a month in VM before moving on since I had Ubuntu running well. Installed OMV .2 just after Thanksgiving and have been hooked ever since.


    Hard to believe it's been 9yrs

    Air Conditioners are a lot like PC's... They work great until you open Windows.


    Edited once, last by KM0201 ().

  • I ran a recovery diskette for years because it could automatically add all drives to NFS, that was fancy back then. As a plus, it also had an unusable x.500 client.


    I've never been a "computer" person, and for that fact I like that OMV is Debian based as help is plentiful, almost too plentiful. I'm starting to stay away from its GUI though, bad things can happen in there.

  • I've seen the yellow banner at the top asking me to apply changes, but I'm not sure what I've changed. Maybe somewhere there is a text view of the command queue which is about to be ran (when you click apply), but I haven't seen it. I'd like to have those commands right in my face every time.


    But I do think OMV is amazing. Without playing a fluffer, I know nothing magically appears, so thanks to all who've taken some time out of their life to create it.

  • I've seen the yellow banner at the top asking me to apply changes, but I'm not sure what I've changed.

    So that means bad things are happening? There has been a couple of OMV updates that require applying changes. Otherwise, it should have been a change you made. If you want to see what modules are dirty, you can look at /var/lib/openmediavault/dirtymodules.json. It won't tell you the exact changes but you really should know what changes you made. I think a request for OMV 6 has been made to make this a little more accessible but it won't be like a git diff.

    omv 5.6.5 usul | 64 bit | 5.11 proxmox kernel | omvextrasorg 5.6.1
    omv-extras.org plugins source code and issue tracker - github


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  • I think OMV is amazing too. Had so good experiences with it. It is easy to use. Which is really important for me since I don't have that much knowledge yet and still try to gain more knowledge.

  • So that means bad things are happening?

    Potentially, yes! I was directed to this thread from another where I had inquired about a pending change email I'd gotten. Because I knew I had not changed anything, klaxons and huge flashing red lights started going off in my head. If the system wants changes committed and I haven't made any changes, then I can only assume Very Bad Things are afoot! Good to know that it's benign, but it's very alarming.


    That said, I do really like OMV and it's served me well for years now. Keep up the good work & thanks!

  • Potentially, yes! I was directed to this thread from another where I had inquired about a pending change email I'd gotten. Because I knew I had not changed anything, klaxons and huge flashing red lights started going off in my head. If the system wants changes committed and I haven't made any changes, then I can only assume Very Bad Things are afoot! Good to know that it's benign, but it's very alarming.


    That said, I do really like OMV and it's served me well for years now. Keep up the good work & thanks!

    The prior context was exclusively for unnoticed mouse clicks. In your case it seems that everything is good. Now when you've found your system reconfigured and you DIDN'T get an email...

  • The prior context was exclusively for unnoticed mouse clicks. In your case it seems that everything is good. Now when you've found your system reconfigured and you DIDN'T get an email...

    Not exclusively -- ryecoaaron replied to you: "There has been a couple of OMV updates that require applying changes." These are what I saw. Of course not expecting such a thing I could only assume the worst. Either my system had been hacked and someone was changing things, or what I though more likely, something had become corrupted and I could no longer trust the system until I totally rebuilt it or at least understood what happened. Going through my mind was, "Ok, assuming corruption, what caused it? What got damaged? Is there anything thing else damaged -- latent problems I might not see until the worst possible time? Is it just the system or is my data damaged as well, or at risk?" Without answers to all those questions I wouldn't trust it. Fortunately the correct answer was, "there is no corruption" but I had no indication of that at the time. Surprises are bad.....


    And actually the available mechanism to investigate wouldn't have helped me even had I know about it. After googling a bit I found the command to dump the list of dirty modules. All that told me was something had changed WRT initramfs. Seeing that alarmed me even more -- If that's gone wrong something must be seriously bad. Then I found the links to the thread I mentioned prior as well as this one.


    But yes I'll agree silent failures are worse.


    I'd rather there never be updates that do this, but I have done enough software to know that sometimes you have to do what you have to do. However would it be possible to change the flag from a simple clean/dirty to perhaps a tri-state (or n-state?) flag representing clean/dirty (for the typical case)/sysupdate (for this particular case) and presenting a more specific dialog & email?

  • I'd rather there never be updates that do this, but I have done enough software to know that sometimes you have to do what you have to do. However would it be possible to change the flag from a simple clean/dirty to perhaps a tri-state (or n-state?) flag representing clean/dirty (for the typical case)/sysupdate (for this particular case) and presenting a more specific dialog & email?

    I don't think the system should change because you are paranoid about being hacked. The only package that changes something and doesn't apply the change is the openmediavault package itself.


    So, think about how someone would have to hack your system. They would have to create a new openmediavault package and put it in the omv repo. Then they would have to change something but not apply it. If they are going through that extreme amount of effort, why wouldn't they just apply the change so people would suspect anything? But in reality, why would someone go through all of this effort for the relatively small userbase of OMV?


    I have a suggestion method that should eliminate this fear:


    1. backup your system before applying updates.
    2. copy your database to a secondary location - example: sudo cp /etc/openmediavault/config.xml /root/
    3. when updates are available, install all openmediavault package updates only before anything else. It is possible it pulls in a few other packages though. Don't apply changes yet.
    4. diff the new database and old database - diff /etc/openmediavault/config.xml /root/config.xml - this will show you want changes were made that will be written to config files when you apply. If you don't see anything suspicious, then you should feel ok that no one has hacked your system.
    5. Install all other updates
    6. Apply changes

    If you are still paranoid about this method, you shouldn't use Windows or connect anything to the internet and make sure to wear your tinfoil hat.

    omv 5.6.5 usul | 64 bit | 5.11 proxmox kernel | omvextrasorg 5.6.1
    omv-extras.org plugins source code and issue tracker - github


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  • I don't think the system should change because you are paranoid about being hacked. The only package that changes something and doesn't apply the change is the openmediavault package itself.

    Let me repeat what I wrote above, this time with emphasis for comprehension: "Either my system had been hacked and someone was changing things, or what I thought more likely, something had become corrupted"


    I've seen databases get stomped on, stray pointers clobbering memory somewhere, multi-threaded code that's not actually thread-safe, all kinds of bugs. Software bugs are not at all uncommon. And often those sorts of bugs end up costing me hours of work so when I see something odd, quite understandably I think, I get concerned. It's a nuisance if the system b0rks itself and has to be rebuilt. It's a potential disaster if it b0rks itself and takes data with it. And if one sees unexpected behaviour like "something has changed but I changed nothing", how would one know that something is not badly wrong?


    So I now know that running apt-upgrade on the command line can have the unexpected side effect of needing to check the GUI for changes (or waiting for an alert via email). I didn't know this a few days ago. How about the rest of the user base? I guess everyone will need to encounter it for themselves. Or maybe the messaging could be a bit more self-explanatory?


    And is this something new in 5.x because I don't recall ever seeing it in 4.x


    Don't you worry about my backup routine -- I have a multi-tiered strategy. There is no Windows computer in the house. Obviously I am connecting to the internet else I wouldn't be able to be writing this. That's not to say that I don't take sensible safety and privacy precautions. As for the tin-foil hat, would you also suggest that I put my wifi router in one of those expensive Faraday cages to stop all horrible RF getting out? /s


  • "Either my system had been hacked and someone was changing things, or what I thought more likely, something had become corrupted"

    Corruption is far more probable than hacking. That issue is easily addressed - backup your OS. Backup is best practice in any case.

    I suspect you know this, but for the causal reader:
    If no server ports are exposed at the router and the default password is changed, a Linux server is extremely hard to get into. Adding to that, hackers are not interested in hard targets that have little to no chance of a significant payday. They're looking for lucrative low hanging fruit. For those reasons, the criminal element has little to no interest in direct attacks on Linux based home servers.

  • how would one know that something is not badly wrong?

    I actually look at it the other way.. Why would someone assume a normal OMV function isn't ok?

    And if one sees unexpected behaviour like "something has changed but I changed nothing",

    If the system was just sitting there and all of sudden wanted to apply updates, that would be one thing. But you did change something, you installed an update.

    I've seen databases get stomped on, stray pointers clobbering memory somewhere, multi-threaded code that's not actually thread-safe, all kinds of bugs. Software bugs are not at all uncommon. And often those sorts of bugs end up costing me hours of work so when I see something odd, quite understandably I think, I get concerned. It's a nuisance if the system b0rks itself and has to be rebuilt. It's a potential disaster if it b0rks itself and takes data with it

    I've seen all that shit too. But I haven't seen any of that caused by updating packages on a simple home NAS.

    How about the rest of the user base? I guess everyone will need to encounter it for themselves. Or maybe the messaging could be a bit more self-explanatory?

    Most of the OMV user base is just going to click apply and not think twice about it.

    would you also suggest that I put my wifi router in one of those expensive Faraday cages to stop all horrible RF getting out?

    Nope, turn off wifi, it is insecure lol

    omv 5.6.5 usul | 64 bit | 5.11 proxmox kernel | omvextrasorg 5.6.1
    omv-extras.org plugins source code and issue tracker - github


    Please read this before posting a question.
    Please don't PM for support... Too many PMs!

  • And if one sees unexpected behaviour like "something has changed but I changed nothing", how would one know that something is not badly wrong?

    Do you want to see the old behaviour were such changes were done without asking the user? Surely not. If you don't like the way how such things are handled by OMV, then it may be the wrong software for you. Sadly.

  • Do you want to see the old behaviour were such changes were done without asking the user? Surely not. If you don't like the way how such things are handled by OMV, then it may be the wrong software for you. Sadly.

    I personally like the OpenWRT approach,
    When you modify a router setting, before applying the modifications you can have a view of the corresponding command lines which would have done the same thing, the standard guys don"t read it and just click on the button, the nerds are happy to see the command lines.

  • Just turn off e-mail notifications.


    Alternatively you could setup a script with your desired logic on OMV to respond if all is O.K. to your liking. eg. Client: "Hey there sexy!", OMV: "Back at ya!". I mean if you _REALLY_ cared, you would do this anyways. I don't think Spetsnaz is targeting me, but I still have a script to check rsync logs for my pictures.

    ...make sure to wear your tinfoil hat.

    How did he KNOW you have a tinfoil hat!!!! Spies everywhere!!!

  • you can have a view of the corresponding command lines which would have done the same thing, the standard guys don"t read it and just click on the button, the nerds are happy to see the command lines.

    I don't think that would work here. There's more to it than just command lines and scripts. There's a framework (SALT) and a back end config database involved, that support the frontend GUI. In some cases, operations done on the command line are reverted (like changes to SMB).

    While there's no substitute for the command line, the GUI is the focus in OMV because is acts as a bridge for several types of users. It provides short cuts for Pro-Admin's who are short on time, all the way through a range of users to absolute beginners. There's plenty of distro's out there that are command line oriented, but very few have a comprehensive GUI.

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